View Full Version : When does something become 'alive'?
25-04-2009, 05:54 PM
Very much the focus of the whole 'abortion' debate, in your opinions exactly when does 'life' begin?
An embryo is 'potential for life' since the moment of conception, but surely semen and ova are 'potential' for life in the same respect, they 'could' have become life when introduced to each other. Of course masturbation and abortion shouldn't be regarded as the same, the point remains.
My personal stance is that we would essentially introduce a dynamically decreasing amount of weeks in which abortion should be allowed. The current record for youngest foetus is 21 weeks and with medical advancements, that could very much fall relatively soon but eventually we will reach a point where what is essentially a ball of cells could not possibly survive outside of the womb, so where should we draw the line then?
25-04-2009, 06:05 PM
As far as im concerned, it is as soon as the heart starts to beat.
3-4 weeks i believe.
25-04-2009, 08:12 PM
If the fetus can support life on its own then it should be considered worthy of living. Everyone raises their children to the point where then can live on their own. Other then the potential for life while being a fetus, there is not much difference between living inside the womb and living on the outside. I know it's heartless for me to speak like this but its only, humans that actually value others lives over their own. Not animal would continue to look after more young then it could possibly care for. No mother would sacrifice herself knowing that the children would die. Abortion in general is against the whole principle of life, but the potential argument can be argued.
If a mother is going to die in the effect of have a child, yes that child can produce more offspring. However in the event of maternal death, there is a higher probability that the child may not reach maturity and reproduce. To me this means that a mother has more potential in life then a child who would have in the act of being born killed its mother.
Likewise in the effect of a mother not being able to afford a child and having to sell herself to raise the child is equally detrimental. Yes good people can come from bad situations, at the same time however you cannot argue the fact that there is a higher probability that the lifestyle of this child will be negative on the rest of humanity.
In the case of laziness, however where parents just do not want to care for their child, abortion should be illegal. If you’re stupid enough to get pregnant and have millions of dollars to use at your disposal, buy some birth control (but chose not to), and prevent the pregnancy altogether not once a child has been conceived.
With all that being said I know this brings up many other topics. If we didn't regulate ourselves with money, and most people were addicting to helping others and volunteering a lot of social problems (class systems, debt, and educational differences) WOULD NOT EXIST. I will go so far as to say "Abortion rates would be lower, if people spent less time working and more time living."
As to when should a fetus can be considered a person... the moment a cell can develop into a new individual. Unless there is a risk of having the child, why would you choose abortion?
28-04-2009, 03:56 PM
In a human the babies heart does not start beatin till around 2 weeks (Seen it on national geographic program :D). So if you have an abortion after 2 weeks then you are killing a life form. It is basically impossible to know your pregnant till after this stage.
I couldn't go through an abortion as I see it as murder but thats just my personal view on it and dont think any different to those that do it.
Also I don't beleive it shouldnt just be down to the women to decide whether to go through with the abortion either if you are with someone. It should be a joint decision with your partner. Yeah ok women have to carry it for 9 months but it takes 2 to tango and 2 to make a baby. (And thats coming from a womans point of view :) )
09-06-2009, 06:47 PM
I agree with the 'potential for life' argument, once a sperm and egg combine they have the potential to become a life, so to me when it 'becomes' alive, when the 'soul' (That's what I'm calling it, you might believe intellect, or nothing at all) enters a bady, or when a heart starts to beat etc is irrelevent since left alone all these things will happen.
However I also strongly believe that everyone is entitled to their own beliefs and opinions, I believe wat i believe and I don't like being judged or attempted conversions to other points of view so I don't do it to others.
Abortion is essentially a form of murder, but in some ways kinder since there 'shouldn't' be any pain (who knows wat a foetus experiences) and they don'y know wat they're loosing. So if the issue is a legal one I feel I don't have enough facts or experience to make any kind of judgement call. If it's moral however I think unless its your baby (fathers and relatives count in this argument) then it's not your call to make.
All i know is that someone I know has had an abortion and even though she still thinks it was the right decision, she thinks about it alot and feels bad about it.
Tricky topic. Respect other people's opinions, they don't affect you (unless they do then of course go nuts)
09-06-2009, 07:13 PM
up till the abortion date, but that is diffrent in england to other contries?
when your grown in you mummys tummy
21-06-2009, 01:50 AM
I'm a supporter of post-natal abortions so i doubt anyone will agree with me when i say life is worthless and that YOU deserve to die right now.
In all seriousness, i think abortion is fine until the CNS is fully developed and it is fully aware of it's surroundings. I have no idea how far into pregnancy that is.
21-06-2009, 01:57 AM
you shouldnt even masturabte as you are killing your own sperm. abortion is plain wrong no matter when it is done, the only time you could legitimately have one is if you are raped, if it would threaten your own life or if it was going to be a mutant. but hey each to their own.
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